[Billy Idol]

To all PC gaming gods, I need advise!

I have the following problem since about two month with my PC:

I play BF3 (origin) or I play Borderlands 2 (steam) and after 1-5min, the game suddenly freezes, I get to the desktop. I have to use Task Manager to quit the game, as it does not respond anymore. Sometimes, but not always? A Windows message pops up and says:

"NVidia Display Driver stopped responding, could be recovered" (cant remember exactly...)

After the game crashes once, I just restart it and I can run it without problems for 5hours straight?!?

I have a GTX 480, the latest NVidia Driver 306, but I also tried 304 and 301, no difference. My OS is Windows 7 64 bit, Borderlands 2 seems to be DX9 32 bit according to task manager.

I am not sure, but if I remember correctly, all the trouble started with the latest BF3 patch, right before Armored Kill arrived. I first thought AK is the reason, but it happens in CQ as well. And now I am playing Borderlands 2 and it happens every single time!

Someone knows whats going on?

Thanks.

[swaaye]

I think you could have power supply issues or perhaps failing GPU solder joints.

[Billy Idol]

Hm, I also thought about a hardware problem, but than I have the following situation:

It crashes the first minute I play. I than just restart the game and I can play without a problem for as long as I want to (more than 5 hours straight e.g.).

That is why I think it is a software related problem, as a hardware problem should happen more often and more inconsistently?!?

[Davros]

try this, play a game that doesnt crash for 5 mins then play one that does crash

[Billy Idol]

Originally Posted by Davros

try this, play a game that doesnt crash for 5 mins then play one that does crash

Ok, I'll try it out!!? Err, why? What is the reasoning behind this?

[Davros]

Im thinking its the sudden rise in temps thats causing the crash
running a different game would pre-warm the card

your card has an auto fan speed if its raised by gpu activity and not temp the game may not be using the part of the gpu enough to trigger the fan speed.

[Billy Idol]

Originally Posted by Davros

Im thinking its the sudden rise in temps thats causing the crash
running a different game would pre-warm the card

your card has an auto fan speed if its raised by gpu activity and not temp the game may not be using the part of the gpu enough to trigger the fan speed.

Hm, played couple minutes of Bulletstorm. Did not have problem this time with Borderlands...but before this, PC was already in use.

I will test again this evening.

Thanks for the hint!

[Billy Idol]

Ok, so I did the tests.

I played Bulletstorm a couple of minutes before starting Borderlands 2.

When playing Bulletstorm, I suddenly get a black screen, a second later I can resume the game if nothing ever happened.

After this playing BL2: no problems.

Starting BL2 directly causes still the crash.

So whats up with my PC???

[Bludd]

Can you borrow another PSU to try?

[Billy Idol]

Originally Posted by Bludd

Can you borrow another PSU to try?

Hm, I have to ask around, unfortunately most of my gaming friends are console guys

So you guys think it is indeed a hardware problem? And not a software problem?

[Bludd]

Well, you need to eliminate variables. PSU problems are notoriously hard to diagnose, IMO.

[Billy Idol]

I also experienced the following: after this crash happens, I can play BL2 for hours without a problem. But after such a gaming session, if I want to watch a movie in the browser, say youtube...it does not work. Just nothing happens if I click play, sometimes firefox freezes, or just nothing happens.

I have to restart, to watch movies again...but after restart, watching a movie, than I have the same problem with BL again...

System stopped saying Display Driver stopped working. Now, game freezes, probably black screen, task manager says not responding. Without windows telling me something...

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Originally Posted by Billy Idol

Hm, I have to ask around, unfortunately most of my gaming friends are console guys

So you guys think it is indeed a hardware problem? And not a software problem?

Hardware problems often cause problems with software. One of the hardest things I ever had to diagnose was intermittent system lock-ups with similar symptoms to yours ie, might lock up in a few minutes, or work fine for hours. Turned out to be a faulty system hard drive that couldn't remap a bad block. Any time that particular block was accessed, the whole system would lock.

You can't just assume that software failing isn't caused by some underlying hardware problem, especially if other people aren't having the same problems with the software concerned.

[ERP]

Unfortunately that particular error is relatively common, and can be caused by almost anything.
All the error tells you is that the windows watchdog timer for the display driver timed out and restarted the display driver. It's referred to a TDR error if you want to google for it.

It can be caused by problems with the GPU itself, I had a GT260 card a few years ago that would only do it while playing WOW, no other game, in that case it was a factory over clocked card and reducing the speeds to be the same as the not "overclocked" ones resolved it.

However it can also be caused by specific drivers (not necessarily graphics related) or worse combinations of drivers, say particular ethernet drivers in combination with audio drivers.

When NVidia had a forum, it was pretty common to see people with TDR problems, but it's not an NVidia specific issue. It didn't happen pre Vista, but only because the OS had no time to reset the driver, it would just show up as a lockup or a long pause in gameplay.

If you can repro the fault, i.e. verify it's fixed, you can try removing all of the chipset and related drivers, then try installing them one at a time.

[Silent_Buddha]

The symptoms could also potential point to a potential solder issue. Perhaps one game is causing a drastic rise in temps putting more stress on the solder points. While other games are putting slightly less stress and the solder points can warm up slightly slower.

I believe with the Fermi line of cards, Nvidia was still in the process of coming to grips with how to deal with lead free solder. They got better with it towards the end of that generation.

That's just one potential though. There's other hardware issues that could potentially cause that (caps? VRMs? Etc...). I find it unlikely that the software stack/driver stack will cause this sort of behavior, but you never know.

Regards,
SB

[Davros]

can you manually control the fan speed on your gfx card
try setting it to 100%

[Billy Idol]

Originally Posted by Davros

can you manually control the fan speed on your gfx card
try setting it to 100%

How could I do this?
(sorry, noob!)

Btw, how can I track the GPU temperature?

Edit: its afterburner, right?

Edit2: did a 3d bench from MSI Kombistor. GPU temp went up to 92 degree celcius. About one degree per 1.5 seconds, than stabilized at 92 degree.

[Billy Idol]

After doing the Bench test in MSI Kombustor, with about 90 degree celcius GPU, I directly started Borderlands 2. Maybe a coincidence, but it did not crash this time?!

[swaaye]

The temps are fine. If you can't test another PSU, I say get a replacement video card if you have warranty.

[Davros]

Originally Posted by Billy Idol

After doing the Bench test in MSI Kombustor, with about 90 degree celcius GPU, I directly started Borderlands 2. Maybe a coincidence, but it did not crash this time?!

keep doing that see if theres any validity in my theory is the sudden heating of the card/solder issue

ps: your gpu went to 90 with he fan speed at 100% ?

[Billy Idol]

Originally Posted by Davros

keep doing that see if theres any validity in my theory is the sudden heating of the card/solder issue

ps: your gpu went to 90 with he fan speed at 100% ?

Yep, will try it out again.

No, 92 with 'standard' settings as it was. Afterburner says that the fanspeed was about 65%.

When I play Bordelands, fanspeed is way higher as it is way louder...

Will test more and report back!

Thanks to all, especially Davros, for the comments and help!

Billy

[Billy Idol]

Hm, worked again. I simple started the 720p benchmark test in msi kombustor, which put the temp up to 90 in a controlled manner.

Started borderlands after this, no problems again !

Have to test something, as I reduced PhysX to get better fps for true vault hunter mode. If I remember correctly, this did not have a positive impact on this issue back than. But I will try it with full PhysX again, just to be 100% sure it is not related.

[Billy Idol]

So, before playing Borderlands 2, I always do some GPU warm up using MSI kombustor. I use the 720p first, then the 1080 benchmark.

After this starting directly Borderlands 2...no problem anymore, never got a crash with BL2.

So, does this really indicate a hardware problem, a problem with heat, when to much immediate load from a cold start?

[HMBR]

Originally Posted by swaaye

perhaps failing GPU solder joints.

this would be my guess, all my previous Geforces (all from g8x, g9x gen) suffered this kind of problem I think... it was really annoying how random it could be with the crashes, but the only fix that really worked was buying a new card... trying different things with the rest of the PC had some effects... but it would ultimately have the drivers crashing, so I tested the same PC with more than one card from AMD and it worked stable...

I've seen a few reports of people successfully solving issues related to solder on their cards using a oven at around 150-200 C for a few minutes

[swaaye]

Yeah it's the NV bumpgate issue that goes back to G7x. But I thought we were past that now. I've had problems with 8800GT myself and it is display driver crashes among other things that happen.